Anti-Immigration Rallies in Germany Defy Calls to Desist

[steven36]

DRESDEN, Germany — Defying appeals from an array of German institutions to stay away from anti-immigration rallies, some 18,000 people took part in a protest here on Monday, parading against what they call the Islamization of Europe and putting pressure on the authorities to defuse social tensions.

The turnout more or less equaled that of late December, before Chancellor Angela Merkel urged Germans in her New Year’s address to shun the rallies and their organizers, who she said had “prejudice, coldness, even hatred in their hearts.”

The latest protest illustrated the depth of the challenge faced by the establishment and the many Germans who see their country as open and even eager to give shelter to refugees from Mideast wars and bolster the labor force with immigrants.

Several thousand people turned out in Berlin to counter the several hundred who had formed an anti-immigration rally. A few thousand also countered the equally sparse anti-immigration crowd in Cologne.

In Berlin, Martin Küper, 31, said he was “disgusted” at the idea that a German would protest against people who “had already been threatened by death and deportation in their home countries.”

In gestures intended to deny anti-immigration protesters picturesque backdrops for their rallies, the church and city authorities in Cologne and Berlin switched off the illumination at three of the country’s best-known landmarks: the Cologne Cathedral and, in Berlin, the Brandenburg Gate and the TV tower at Alexanderplatz.

In Dresden, where about 3,000 people staged a counterdemonstration, the group known as Pegida — the German acronym for Patriotic Europeans Against Islamization of the West — was confined to a park and a march around a nearby stadium. Ironically, the park is named the Cockerwiese after the late rock singer Joe Cocker, who gave a concert there in 1988, during Communist rule, and whose trademark song was “With a Little Help from My Friends.”

Monday night’s rally, held in a cold rain, yielded nothing new in the way of sentiment from the speakers, whose group insists that it wants to help refugees, but is against asylum abusers, foreigners who mooch off Germany and what it sees as a creeping Islamization of society.

But the mention of Ms. Merkel’s name drew boos, and several people interviewed — typically declining to give their names to reporters — said her criticism of Pegida had disqualified her as a leader.

Earlier on Monday, business leaders joined the swelling chorus against Pegida from established political parties, the Roman Catholic and Protestant churches, social groups and even anonymous jokesters who set up a spoof “Snowgida” page on Facebook.

Ingo Kramer, head of the Confederation of German Employers’ Associations, said, “Germany’s image as a business location is being damaged by the impression that we are demonstrating against foreigners.”

“We need immigration for our labor market and to allow our social system to function,” he added in a statement.

The fear of foreigners, especially Muslims, threatening or drowning out national and regional identities forged over centuries seems to have a growing pull in Europe, where populists and nationalists scored record gains in elections in May for the European Parliament.

Since reuniting in 1990, Germany has experienced outbursts of racist violence directed against foreigners, often in the east, where barely 1 percent of the population was non-German in Communist times.

In recent years, however, the Germans have offered asylum liberally, beginning with refugees of the Balkan wars of the early 1990s. The nation’s Nazi past is often cited as a reason to offer sanctuary, but that has worn thin recently because of an influx of about 200,000 asylum seekers last year — four times the total for 2012 — and the strain of housing so many people.

An anti-euro party, the Alternative for Germany, is flirting with anti-foreigner sentiment and won seats in three state legislatures in eastern Germany in the fall. While its leaders are bickering furiously, at least some have attended the Dresden rallies and are willing to meet with Pegida.

Across the established political spectrum, debate has raged about whether to engage directly with Pegida, as well as how to confront its clear appeal to a disgruntled segment of the German population. Its supporters include far rightists, neo-Nazis and soccer hooligans, as well as a larger number of average citizens who seem worried about losing status, even if — in Dresden and the surrounding state of Saxony — barely 2 percent of residents are foreigners and even fewer are Muslims.

On Tuesday, the country’s best-selling newspaper, Bild, headlined articles with “The People Are Stopping Pegida” and highlighted efforts to support immigration. Berthold Kohler, a publisher of the influential center-right newspaper Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung, noted Monday in a commentary titled “Terribly Simple” that, despite Ms. Merkel’s stand against the Pegida movement, it was clear that her coalition government of center-right and center-left was still trying to figure out what to do. The movement, he said, is “the tip of the iceberg” when it comes to a loss of faith in elites or institutions across the board.

Ms. Merkel’s partners in her conservative bloc, the Bavarian Christian Social Union, plan to debate what they call “a fair and balanced asylum policy” at a meeting this week. That policy would involve a swifter processing of asylum requests and deportation of abusers, portraying this as the only way to continue guaranteeing a welcome for hundreds of thousands of legitimate refugees, particularly from Syria and Iraq.

“People are reacting to the situation with much understanding, empathy and remarkable voluntary engagement,” the party said in the proposal. All who are helping should be thanked, it added, “for they are the face of modern Germany, open to the world.”

Among the many voices discussing Pegida were the writer Peter Schneider, who over the weekend published his impressions of a visit to the last Pegida rally on Dec. 22.

“For my taste,” Mr. Schneider wrote in the newspaper Die Welt, “the crowd was too white.”

He also noted that any number of issues — like Islamic State jihadists, Palestinian immigrants voicing anti-Semitism, or European women opposing Muslim attitudes toward women — deserved to be discussed in Germany and elsewhere in Europe where large numbers of immigrants live.

The answer certainly does not lie in declining dialogue with Pegida or its supporters, Mr. Schneider wrote.

“If political correctness means that facts can no longer be called by their name,” he concluded, “then society is robbing itself of a viable future.”

Source: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/06/world/europe/pegida-rally-dresden-germany.html?_r=0

[GRiM]

It's about time a rally like that happened in UK!

[dMog]

do people forget how Hitler and the nazi party got their foot hold.... i mean come on man grab some brains and think things through...and before you decry me for comparing this to hilter and what he made the nazi movement stand for to what is happening to day go back and take a close look at what he did to begin...especially who he blamed for germany's problems and he eventually dealt with them and how everyone either accepted it or was themselves looked at as part of the problem...and you certainly do not need one of those rallies in England

[212eta]

When patriots react -as they see their nations turning into a multi-cultural soup-

the propagandists of Globalization/New World Order

call them 'racists', 'xenophobic'etc.

For obviou$ rea$on$,

Globalization/New World Order want Chip-Labor

immigrants inside the Western-world societies.

[Reefa]

It's about time a rally like that happened in UK!

To right fellow immigration is a joke in this country and has been for a long time..And it's just getting worse..And no i'm not a racist just a realist..

[GRiM]

do people forget how Hitler and the nazi party got their foot hold.... i mean come on man grab some brains and think things through...and before you decry me for comparing this to hilter and what he made the nazi movement stand for to what is happening to day go back and take a close look at what he did to begin...especially who he blamed for germany's problems and he eventually dealt with them and how everyone either accepted it or was themselves looked at as part of the problem...and you certainly do not need one of those rallies in England

No we hadn't forgot and it's completely irrelevant. You simply cannot compare what the Nazi party did to anything remotely what is being discussed here. You can try and see similarities and place the racist card all you want, it's irrelevant and not appropriate.

[flash48]

Lets look at this another way. What would happen if Jewish people decided to immigrate to Saudi?

[The Owl]

but dMog is exactly right in that demo's like this is exactly how the Nazi Party got a foot hold and strangely enough in the Dresden area

[dMog]

do people forget how Hitler and the nazi party got their foot hold.... i mean come on man grab some brains and think things through...and before you decry me for comparing this to hilter and what he made the nazi movement stand for to what is happening to day go back and take a close look at what he did to begin...especially who he blamed for germany's problems and he eventually dealt with them and how everyone either accepted it or was themselves looked at as part of the problem...and you certainly do not need one of those rallies in England

No we hadn't forgot and it's completely irrelevant. You simply cannot compare what the Nazi party did to anything remotely what is being discussed here. You can try and see similarities and place the racist card all you want, it's irrelevant and not appropriate.

it is also not right to lump in good people who emigrated to get away from the radicalism in their country with the radical @sses is all am tying to get across....

[steven36]

saying the Nazi power will ever rise to rule Germany again is about like saying Pro southern states racist groups are going rule part of USA again (they still rally) it most likely will never happen in our lifetime if ever . Every country has immigration problems but some places deal with it much better than others . Like the USA - Germany has more people against racist groups than are for them . Like GRiM said there's no need to blame it on the racist card because people are mad because people are taking up there land and all there jobs and food.

[The Owl]

Pro southern states racist groups are going rule part of USA again

You mean they don't?? SHOCK HORROR!!!!!

[steven36]

Pro southern states racist groups are going rule part of USA again

You mean they don't?? SHOCK HORROR!!!!!

most everyone looks them like there nuts . they have to hide to rally . When ever they do rally in public they need police protection to keep from being mobbed by everyday people . They been saying the south is going rise again every since they lost the civil war and its never going to happen they stand for a lost cause that was wrong . I'm a firm believer if you do wrong and stand for the wrong cause sooner or latter the right cause will prevail and all threw history these wrong causes fell.

[The Owl]

the religious right has a hell (forgive the pun) of a lot of control over the politics / politicians of the south

[steven36]

the religious right has a hell (forgive the pun) of a lot of control over the politics / politicians of the south

Only because everyone has a vote in the south most old people are religious . And laws are made on how people vote . I doubt in the future they will most there old laws are no go anymore when made a federal law its applied to 50 states they only can control some laws made at a state level by there vote. the USA has a Separation of church and state unlike some

Some socially secularized countries such as Denmark and the United Kingdom have maintained constitutional recognition of an official state religion

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Separation_of_church_and_state

[steven36]

Only because everyone has a vote in the south

When they are not tricked out of it

:lol: really when it comes to politics , No politician is going to do exactly as they say . Even if they wanted too a politician is just a vote with more power with other powers just as powerful voting for them or against him . Just because they want do to good or bad does not mean other powers are going let them. Its not that easy . Only when they all agree does things get passed . :)

[The Owl]

hardly surprising we have a "Officially Recognised Church" a, Good old King Henry threw the Catholics out back then and the "Crown" became head of the Church, without which b, you would not have a Anglican Church today

[steven36]

People in the USA really dont have a vote when it comes down too it on who becomes President this was proved when Bush took office Gore had more votes than Bush . Bush only won by electoral votes by actual votes Gore won . So really when it comes to this people are just fooling themselves thinking that vote really matters much . Only reason Obama won was because there was no one good running against him to get electoral votes or actual votes ether one.

[GRiM]

do people forget how Hitler and the nazi party got their foot hold.... i mean come on man grab some brains and think things through...and before you decry me for comparing this to hilter and what he made the nazi movement stand for to what is happening to day go back and take a close look at what he did to begin...especially who he blamed for germany's problems and he eventually dealt with them and how everyone either accepted it or was themselves looked at as part of the problem...and you certainly do not need one of those rallies in England

No we hadn't forgot and it's completely irrelevant. You simply cannot compare what the Nazi party did to anything remotely what is being discussed here. You can try and see similarities and place the racist card all you want, it's irrelevant and not appropriate.

it is also not right to lump in good people who emigrated to get away from the radicalism in their country with the radical @sses is all am tying to get across....

Look I dont give a sh1t, I'm just sick of the open door policy my country has had for years ...end of.