~ TALES FROM THE OLD SIDE ~

[humble3d]

~ TALES FROM THE OLD SIDE ~

4 Surgeries to Avoid

The four operations discussed are often overperformed. Some are moneymakers for doctors and hospitals; others are expedient and still others seem to work, at least in the short term. But evidence shows that all have questionable long-term outcomes for treating certain conditions, and some may even cause harm. Consider these alternatives.

Stents for Stable Angina

Stents are tiny mesh tubes that surgeons use to prop open arteries carrying blood to the heart. If a patient is having a heart attack, a stent can be a lifesaver. But for heart disease patients with stable angina — chest pain brought on by exertion or stress — a stent is not better at preventing a heart attack or prolonging survival than lifestyle changes.

Alternatives to Surgery

If your doctor orders a heart catheterization to explore your blood vessels, ask that he or she wait to perform any treatment such as stenting in a separate procedure. Even before submitting to a heart cath, make sure you’ve explored other alternatives. Do you adhere to a strict diet, exercise or take medications to manage your cholesterol? If plaque is forming in your arteries, this is a systemic disease, and a stent won’t keep even a full inch of your arteries clear.

Complex Spinal Fusion for Stenosis

With spinal fusion, a surgeon places bone grafts that “weld” two or more vertebrae together to prevent motion and stop pain. The procedure is often used to treat back pain from spinal stenosis, which occurs when the soft tissues between the vertebrae flatten out, creating pressure on the spinal cord or nerves that go to the back, arms, neck, shoulders and legs.


Alternatives to Surgery

Before considering any type of back surgery, make sure you have exhausted more conservative measures, including physical therapy, cortisone injections, acupuncture and medications. “Probably less than 5 percent of all back pain requires surgery,” says orthopedist Arnold Weil, CEO of Non-Surgical Orthopaedics in Marietta, Ga.

Hysterectomy for Uterine Fibroids

Each year more than 400,000 American women have a hysterectomy, or removal of the uterus, and studies show that the vast majority of surgeries are unnecessary. A hysterectomy may be critical when the patient has cancer, but most patients undergo the procedure for quality-of-life concerns such as heavy bleeding or pain caused by uterine fibroids — benign growths in the uterine wall.

Alternatives to Surgery

If you suffer from uterine fibroids, ask your doctor about other options, including uterine-artery embolization, in which the arteries leading to the uterus are blocked, causing the fibroids to stop growing. You might also consider a procedure known as focused ultrasound, which shrinks fibroids via ultrasound waves.

ADDENDUM

Also of Interest

8 ways to shape up for your surgeryThe joys (and oys!) of sex after 50Have you had any of these four surgeries? Join the discussionVisit the AARP home page every day for great deals and for tips on keeping healthy and sharpTopic AlertsYou can get weekly email alerts on the topics below. Just click “Follow.”WE RECOMMENDWatch "The Health Benefits of Beer" Video at AARP - VideosWatch "100 Year Old Bride - AARP" Video at AARP - VideosWatch "Dr. Oz on Diabetes - Myth vs. Fact - My Generation" Video at AARP - VideosWatch "USS Freedom Arrives in Singapore" Video at AARP - Videos7 Credit Cards You Should Not Ignore If You Have Excellent CreditNext AdvisorA Little Known Way to Pay Off MortgageBills.comWarren Buffett Reveals How Anyone With $40 Could Become A Million…The Motley FoolWhy You Should Color Your Gray at HomeeSalonby TaboolaWe recommend •Why Men Should Date Women Their Own Age•Take Charge of Your Money at 70+•Are You a Viagra Wife?•You Won’t Believe What They Found on Colonoscopy…•What's the Maximum Social Security Benefit?•Want to Drop Pounds Fast? Try These Tactics•3 Classic Cruise Ship Rip-Offs to Avoid•When to Claim Social Security Benefits•5 Top Regrets of the Dying•Savvy Flight Attendants Reveal Key In-Flight Tips•Photo Gallery: What 60 Looks Like•3 Breakfast Meals to Keep You Fueled Until LunchFrom TheExpertsSee All Experts »Easy, Healthy and Delicious Portuguese Kale Soup RecipeWith a few simple ingredients, you can make this soup-er food at home today readMore From PamI am retired and 65.  I've dealt with a hernia on my right side since 1997. I have resisted surgery because of the stories I've heard about the replacement screens that have failed.  If this is an unwarranted fear or avoiding this procedure is a bad idea,  convince me...                                                                                             I really enjoy reading this newsletter. However... ahem...You insist on using the "slide show" format which seems designed to require the maximum number of clicks possible and basically prevents printing or otherwise saving the information.Even after clicking to the next slide, you can only read a small portion of the text and then have to scroll down to read the whole caption! Really? Do you think it's a good idea to deliberately inconvenience your readers?Why not have the articles in a single-page-scroll-down format, making it very easy to read, print and save?If you don't want the readers to save or print the information, why bother with the publication in the first place?I hope you consider these constructive comments and improve your newsletter accordingly.And CHIROPRACTIC?  Thank you for not listing it as an 'alternative' because for me ( with numerous fractured vert+ split pelvis) it has been complimentary WITH medical care.I have learned some important facts about my health and being a AARP Member, I have been very pleased with the services they provide.Acupuncture are you kidding??? Studies overwhelmingly indicate it does not work other than placebo effect.I used to have frequent pain in my knees. Nothing debilitating, just annoying, altho every once in a while climbing stairs I'd tweak one just so, and have to stand there for a few minutes until the pain simmered down. My doctor recommended glucosamine. It helped. Then my husband and I started getting acupuncture. That helped too. I practically have no pain now, and don't have bad experiences with stairs. This may not be for everyone, but you owe it to yourself to explore alternatives first, before surgery.In 2012 I had two stents for blockages and then again in 2013 I had three more...I realize they are stop gap measures.  However, three weeks before I had the first ones I had both kinds of "walk the treadmill" stress tests and an endoscopy and EKGs - all were fine - nothing showed up.  I have never had high cholesterol - no diabetes - not obese - guess what - heart attack.  Good thing I had the cath...doctors have told me that this is apparently hereditary and that one percent of people will test fine when not.  I can't take statins but cholesterol is good anyway.(I was adopted and don't have all my family history)  So be careful what you tell people - i will add a surgery to avoid to this list - NEVER BUT NEVER  have your gall bladder out.  See a Natural Healing specialist to try and correct the situation...That surgery was the beginning of my severe stomach/digestive problems.@Sitta81 I've had my gall bladder removed. It's been about 8 years.  I've been totally fine ever since, and free of that horrible pain.@Sitta81 More women in this country die of heart disease than breast cancer, and our heart symptoms are almost totally different than those of men. I thought an article in a recent AARP magazine written by a doctor about the differences in presentation of this disease between men and women--and the lack of funding to explore the differences--was very enlightening.One of the scariest parts of her narrative was that ER personnel frequently tell women their heart attack symptoms are all in their heads, or just stress-related. Know the symptoms and insist on proper treatment right away. In addition, for all of us, lobby every politician you can for increased research funding for women's heart problems.Between 2004 and 2011, I have had 4 cervical fusions in my neck and 4 back/spinal fusions.I am now 65 years old and have mild to severe chronic pain in both my neck and lumbar spine.  In May I had a Spinal Cord Stimulator (SCS) implanted for my lumbar pain. It has been a God send.  Mine is made by Boston Scientific.  I used to take 3 or 4 prescription pain tablets per day; now, I do not take any during the day and maybe one tablet at bedtime twice a week.  Before I get another SCS for my neck, however, I am going to try getting cortizone shots between the facets.  Any comments anyone?My husband could not even walk to the street to get the mail, he could only stand 2-3 minutes before his legs would go completely numb and he would collapse. He had suffered for years till no longer could he endure the pain and numbness. MRI showed backbone almost broke in half, would have to pin and move to align as much as possible and relieve the spinal cord being pinched. We went to Mayo Clinic in Florida, fusion only way to align the back bone and get it off the spinal cord. We then went to Tampa General in Tampa where this brilliant surgeon from USF came up with same diagnosis. His  surgery was over a year ago and he is pain free can walk 2 miles a day( which is a miracle) and we can dance up a storm. He has his life back. He has spinal fusion with pins. We thank God for this miracle and Dr. Smith (neurosurgeon) from USF and Tampa General. Your study is way off base you better talk with people who have experienced this life changing surgery. We did have a excellent neurosurgeon from USF.I'm thrilled that I had a complete hysterectomy!After surviving estrogen-sensitive breast cancer diagnosed at a "young" age (under 50), dr wanted to remove just my ovaries to block estrogen. I wouldn't let him take the ovaries without doing a total hysterectomy because my family has a history of large fibroids, and I was past the age of reproduction.  Dr sent me to have an ultrasound, which showed no ovarian cysts and no uterine fibroids, but, when I had my hysterectomy, I had both cysts and fibroids! I was already in menopause from chemo, but I had 1 week of hot flashes before I was back to normal.I had also asked about having my appendix out at the same time, but doctors won't do that. (Besides, appendicitis is a disease of the very young and the very old.) Too bad, because 4 weeks after my hysterectomy, I had a burst appendix. 4 weeks after that, I was back in the hospital with peritonitis. The fix for that gave me a hernia, which "needed" surgical repair. The hernia surgical repair is the worst surgery/recovery I've ever had (out of overAt 54, my doctor, an eminent cardiologist, told me I might need a stent for a 60% occluded branch artery.  Am I supposed to go to him now and say, "I read on the Internet that it may not be a good idea"?  How are we, as patients, supposed to use this information?  I think it should be noted in your article that women who have their ovaries removed in their 30s or 40s reduce their risk of breast cancer by 50%.  Since 1 in 8 women develop this disease this procedure should be looked at more closely.There is mounting evidence that women whose diets are meat-heavy may be at higher risk for developing uterine fibroids. Think about what our livestock are not only fed, but injected with, too.The main reason alternative therapies haven't gained traction is because doctors & hospitals don't make money unless they cut on you. Anyone who says different isn't being entirely truthful.What's particularly lacking in any discussion about American healthcare is the "care" part of the equation. The medical industry bears some responsibility, but people need to remember they are just as responsible for the quality of their lives. Doctors can't cure everything, especially abusive lifestyles -drinking, smoking, and especially diet.Nurses, while over-worked & underpaid for their efforts, complain about the revolving door of those who won't take responsibility for the quality of their lives. They want a pill or injection, but no responsibility for what they put in their mouths. The proper functioning of our immune systems -and thus our ability to avoid disease & lead better lives- is directly tied to what we eat.Much of what goes on at clinics & hospitals across our nation are tied to chronic yet preventable disease. Take control. As for the medical industry, I ask you this: With ALL our technological advances, why are we NOT able to detect way before disease sets in? It seems we humans engage in a kind of crap-shoot when we should be able to spot health issues before they grow into death sentences? Then there is the recurring issue of misdiagnoses.Well now, isn't this fun!  I'm a nurse and know that in the days that I was nursing, complications were rare from surgery so when surgery was an option for problems I had, I tried that.  I knew the doctors and knew all the risks.  I had a knee surgery after I developed knee pain that had gotten quite severe.  I was unaware of any injury I'd had.  I had 3 problems with my knee, a small tear, osteoarthritis,  and some other thing which I can't remember the name of.  I was down a lot longer than the doctor predicted.  He said 1 week and it was more like 6 weeks.  But, today, 10 years later, I have NO knee pain.  I don't regret it.  Cortisone shots wear away your bone and you end up with a worse problem.  Then a year or so later, I was having difficulty with severe pain with intercourse but suffered through it for the sake of my husband.  I also thought my bladder was prolapsed.  It turned out I was correct.  The pain was from my bladder being pinched during intercourse.  My doctor did a quick little test to see if surgery would help me.  He thought it would.  I had not told him about the pain.  He told me!  I said, "How did you know?"  He said, "Years of experience".  He recommended a complete hysterectomy with a bladder repair.  He said that if I only had the bladder repair, I would probably be back in 5 years for a hysterectomy for something else.  He said I would never have to worry about uterine Cancer, fibroids,  or ovarian cancer,   Since surgery is not fun, I decided to have the works and never have to come back.  I've seen women die with undiagnosed ovarian cancer.  I had a little trouble with anemia post op, otherwise did fine.  I don't regret the decision and have had no further problems and it's now been 9 years.  Every person is different.  We all have different experiences.  I never feared surgery for more reasons than what I knew.  Death was never a concern.  I figured if it was my time, it was my time and I didn't want to have a worse quality of life for fear of dying.  Many doctors will advise not having surgery if your general health is not good.  I would rather risk dying than suffer for the rest of my life.I since had one surgery that nearly cost me my life.  I got a post operative infection from the surgeon having used the Robot on me.  The robots are fine if the people who clean them know the risks of them not doing a good job.  I didn't want the robot because I trusted the doctor to wash his hands well more than I trusted some other person to clean the robot well.  Turns out my fears were justified.  Four days after my minor surgery, I was having such severe abdominal pain that I sent my husband to work and then called an ambulance for myself.  It took them 10 days to open me back up.  They didn't want to rush me back to surgery.  By waiting so long, my abdomen was full of infection.  I would not have wanted to be in that operating room when they opened me up.  I had to heal from the inside out.  The drainage after surgery smelled so bad, I couldn't imagine how bad it was in that room when they cut me open.  They had to "wash out" all the yuk inside my abdomen.  After a month in the hospital and 3 months to recover, I am now well.  I didn't sue but should have.  Three more people had the same experience after me at the same hospital.  I'm guessing that the people who cleaned the machine were not nurses (to save money) and being uneducated in sterile technique, they did not do a good job because they would not realize the importance of them doing their job well.  Turned out my cousin worked there (I did not know that at the time) and she later told me that she would never have let them use that  robot on her because she knew the people who cleaned it did not do a good job.  She quit working there because of it.  If I had sued, it would have brought attention to the problem sooner.  I didn't sue because I felt, at the time, that it was not intentional; and,  I didn't think one should sue just because they had a bad outcome and I did survive.  My husband was kind of mad at me for not suing because he saw every day what I was going though.  It was pretty horrible.  I wanted to die and prayed to die.  I was within 24 hours of dying but then the antibiotics kicked in.  I was confused and telling some pretty tall tales but things that I said, I believed to be true because I had memories of these things.  My brain was being bathed in bacteria and it really messes with your head.  I don't remember half of my hospital stay.  I had hallucinations,  delusions and vivid "dreams" that I thought were real, and was paranoid.  The staff did not know me so they thought I was just crazy and wanted to put me in a nursing home on discharge.  I refused.  My daughter stuck up for me.  She told them that they don't know her Mom.  She knew I was "crazy" because of the illness, not because I was truly crazy.  I am now running for the US Senate because I think this is what God wants me to do.  We need regular citizens in our government who are not corrupted and who simply want to make their country better.  I am a grandmother now and I want my grandson to grow up in free country and the only way to stop the direction our country is going in is to elect people who are honest Christians that truly care about people.  Most of the people in our government are crooks and don't care about anyone but themselves.  I think this is why I didn't die.  If I don't get elected, then I guess I was wrong, but I have to try.  I don't have a selfish or greedy bone in my body.  I am a giver, not a taker.  I've always worked for everything I have and I'm not going to change my ways now.  I know I can do a better job than the senator we have in Washington now.  It's not my life's ambition and I didn't really want to do it, but if you think God wants you to do it, how you can refuse to try?  So I am.I don't know which is worse, having had a partial hysterectomy (uterus removed only) first then oophectomy 5 years later.  I big time fibroids with heavy bleeding.  Everything went fine for about 5 years then I had to have an ovary removed, starting hemorrhaging in recovery and they took the other ovary and tubes.  When I woke up I knew there was something terribly wrong.  I was severely damaged, yes couldn"t hump anymore and I was in excruciating pain for a year and a half!  I hope the dr. that performed the surgery is rotting in you-know-where!  All he could say about my pain was "sorry to hear that".  What happened to was having just the uterus removed caused the ovaries and tubes to just float around in there by themselves.  One tube was attached to my bladder, I had a lot of clots also.  Dr. said "it was a mess in there.  Oh, and I came out with a kink in my intestines so that I can't have a colonoscopy because they can't get up in there all the way!I wish I had been offered other alternatives in the first place!  This was in 1990.  Please, if you have fibroids research your heart out on alternatives.Your section on stents for stable angina is grotesque in its bias and lack of accuracy.  Please do better research and obtain opinions from both sides of the issue prior to publishing stories that will influence your readers and possibly impact their health adversely.My hysterectomy/oophorectomy was the most horrible thing that ever happened to me. But then I had cancer so I had no real options.  The complications made my bladder leak, caused constant infections, & made sure that humping was no longer a possibility. Surgical menopause made me so sad & depressed that I lost my job & went on disability. I now have osteoporosis and am financially devastated. "Quality of life"...that's hilarious.My hysterectomy was the absolute worst thing that ever happened to me.  But then, I had cancer so I had to do that plus get my ovaries removed. My "quality of life" decreased immensely--the complications ensured that humping was pretty much impossible, the surgical menopause left me so depressed and sad I was able to qualify for Disability, and to top it off I now have osteoporosis and am financially devastated. Quality of life--LOLZ!!!I DONT TRUST THE GOVERMENT OR THE DOCTORS WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT MEDICARE OR THE V.A.THEY WILL LET YOU DIE TO SAVE A PENNY.AND THE DOCTORS ARE IN WITH THE GOVERMENT WHEN IT COMES TO CERTAIN PAY@rvsrsr Did you know that using all caps when you write on the Internet is considered shouting?It's okay for most people to trust our government. We ARE the government. Do you trust yourself? If you don't like the government, vote the people out that you dislike or work to get the laws changed that you don't like. It's not impossible here as it may be in other countries. However, be aware that there are those who are actively working to get us to distrust our government, and they have their own evil aims and goals.Don't know what your experience has been, but I have nothing but good to say for the VA employees and doctors who treat our veteran. They always go over and above what we expect. Undoubtedly, they could use better pay and more help!I had a lower back fusion in 2007 and, for me, it was life saving, because I was beginning to consider suicide due to the agonizing pain from stenosis. I had been thrown off a horse in 1984 and broke vertebrae. I did physical therapy and exercise but over the years the pain increased, I had to walk with crutches, I had sciatic all the time, could not sleep and had no quality of life. Everyone said don't get back surgery, a "friend" of mine got passed at me because I won't go to her chiropractor. I would suggest following your own gut feelings, research your condition, talk to people, get 2nd opinions and make up your own mind. When I woke up in the recovery room after the 6 hour fusion I knew immediately I was better...... it is not a miracle cure, I have some pain, but nothing like before and I have quality of life, I walk, swim and have lots of fun doing activities I couldn't participate in before. Good luck to anyone struggling to live with terrible back pain.My hysterectomy was the best thing that ever happened to me. I tried alternatives and they didn't work. The article even stated most people have a hysterectomy for "quality of life" purposes, why shouldn't everyone have the best quality of life possible? I had mine 11 years ago at age 46. I have had NO problems since then.I had my Hysterectomy  when I was 30 years old because I was having problems the heavy bleeding staying on for 2-3 weeks at a time, extremely painful periods. All I can say is that it was the best thing that I could have ever done. I don't have any  incontinence nor did I have instant menopause and I will be 64 years old on Monday.  If I  had it to do again I am sure that  I would While I agree that acupuncture might be an effective treatment for spinal stenosis in some cases, and it was actually recommended to my mom before she had her spinal surgery, Medicare DOES NOT COVER acupuncture.  Not even with AARP's 'best' supplement!@kt3179 : You gotta love the suggestions for alternative therapies -which many times aren't covered! Agh! Perhaps if we stopped relying so heavily on medical doctors & encouraged chiropractic and/or acupuncture therapies, people wouldn't need to eventually go thru these complicated surgeries!My hysterectomy was the best thing that ever happened to me!Always discuss your options with your physician, ask questions and express your doubts and fears. Get a second opinion and maybe a third. Remember, an insurance company has skin in the game.  That's not where you should be seeking advice.Remember, AARP is primarily in the Insurance business so their choice of 'studies' to prevent surgery for certain conditions has to be questioned as to their motives.I think I will take the dog for a walk.My father in law, a healthy and younger looking 81 year old WWII vet, volunteered at his local hospital and became chummy with some doctors, including the cardiologist, who talked him into a "preventive" heart catheterization, even though he had no symptoms and no complaints. Everything went awry, he was rushed in for a quadruple bypass, and died three days later. The cardiologist billed Medicare a little over $300,000. He didn't come to the funeral or send a card.@MarkVasani Did he settle the lawsuit?@2Papa @MarkVasani : Yes, because in the best of all worlds, money cures everything, right? How do you replace your loved one? Answer: You don't. What that cardiologist did was unconscionable & he should have had his license to practice medicine revoked. A better "use" of a seemingly healthy 81 yr old man would have been to study his lifestyle & habits.Or as in my case Non Hodgkin's Lymphoma had snaked into my spinal column causing stenosis at L-1 & L-2. this was in 2006. My Neurosurgeon had rods ready for my back, but decided not to use them when he did a Laminectomy on L-1 & L-2. I found out about the tumor on a Monday and was operated on at Presby in PGH Thursday Morning, followed by Radiation treatment and Chemo. I don't want to scare anyone, but please make sure what is causing the stenosis.My sister waited to have a a hysterectomy because she had fibroids and they turned into CANCER.  She developed Leiomyosarcoma and died 2 weeks ago at age 48.  PLEASE have your fibroids removed.  Yes it is only a 1% chance of them turning to cancer, but my sister was gone in a year.  :(  Wow, I had a 6 lbd fibroid in my uterus.  Listening to these guys, I would forever look 6 months pregnant and face the abosolute of cancer.I enjoyed this article because there is so much truth to it.  I had a tumor on my last remaining ovary and the doctor performed surgery to remove it. I ended up getting a Hematoma and landed in the hospital hoping that massive amounts of antibiotic would dissolve it.  IT WORKED, OTHERWISE I WOULD HAVE HAD TO HAVE SURGERY FOR THAT. As far as the knee is concerned...I have had 3 knee surgeries and have torn my meniscus but I am doing exercise therapy and eating foods that are anti-inflammatories such as green vegetables (Arugala, peppers and so forth).There is much truth to this article. Marty MaKary, a pancreatic surgeon at John Hopkins, wrote a book called "Unaccountable - what hospitals .........".You can google it and read about it and he's been on 20/20 and talk shows.  He says about 30% of procedures are unnecessary.Also he warns about dangerous docs who are in most hospitals: google "Doctor Hodad" an acronym for "Hands of death and destruction.I have 18 embolization coils put in 2005 and than 2007 they are doing fine and cured my problem done in san franmsico caThe AARP knows as much about medicine as I know about picking winning lottery numbers!They forgot one: infant circumcision.Totally disagree about the fibroid tumor advice.  I was miserable - had large fibroids.  I had extremely heavy bleeding, horrible cramping and had already had an ablation (which helped for about 2 years).  At 50, I opted for LAPRASCOPIC surgery.  90% of all tumors - even super large ones, can be removed this way.  Your Dr. didn't recommend it?  That's because they don't know how to do it.  Find a Dr. that specializes in laprascopic hysterectomies and change your life!!  I was able to keep an ovary and my cervix - and I was back to work in 2 weeks.  Could have been back in one week because the recovery time was minimal, but I had taken 3 weeks off of work and decided that I could use the extra week to clean my house!  Don't live with horrible periods and cramping.  Research laprascopic I retired from 38 years of nursing because of a "bad back", when I was 62.  In all those years I have been under a Dr.s care using several methods to treat my back pain and left leg numbness.  I was finaly diagnosed with Spondylolethesis grade 4 and Osteoarthritis, and got a referral to a neuro surgeon who told me I'd be in a wheel chair in 5 years if I didn't have surgery.  That was in 2000!  In all my years nursing and since, I have NEVER seen anyone get better or pain free after back surgery.  Ask your friends and you'll find out that most times things are unchanged or things have gotten worse.  I set up my home traction with 35# weight and it may take a couple of days but I get relief.  I'm sick to death of Dr.s who want to medicate me with Lortab and Xanax, and my Dr. is a D.O. and the same Dr. I started out with 22yrs ago!  He still offers narcotics, but I don't get them filled.  If I need to take one, it's the first day my back goes "out" and the first time I hook up the traction...which still works!  I will not be riding around in a cart in the store taking up space while others are waiting to get by me!  Don't ya hate that?  I'm 67 this year and I still mow my own yard, I'm active, but I know I have limits and the first twinge of pain tells me to wait for another day before going on!  Sometimes it takes 2 days to mow my front yard, but I am independent and still able.  I would never have back surgery, and I would strongly encourage anyone to ask for "success stories" from their surgeon before they have any surgery.  In fact, just go and hang out in a Brooks Rehab and talk to the people coming and going.  It's an eye-opener to hear that they are on a lifetime rehab AFTER surgery!  Not for me.

MORE NEWS :lol: FROM THE OLD SIDE...

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